SethHappyNemoGuy

Here's mine, my brother's and my Best Buddies Movie Review of Moana! Hope you guys like it and hope we did great! [smile]

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Pixar Post - T.J.
Wait - you think the only Oscar contention is between Zootopia and Moana? I agree that favoring an original rather than a sequel is good, but Dory should definitely be a contender not only because it was a great film, but because of the enormous box office success - fans have definitely responded with their wallets with this one!

And - great job overall, guys! Fun review.
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Luis504170

Moana was amazing. Definitely my favorite animated film of the year.

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CanadianPixarFan
I actually went the route of avoiding trailers and clips before seeing the movie. I had never done this before. I think it did help me enjoy the film more, but it certainly wouldn't have ruined it had I watched the trailers. There were a couple reasons why I was so excited about this film: 
  1. It's a Ron and John film, and they clearly know what they are doing.
  2. I am a big fan of Hamilton on Broadway so I was very excited about Lin-Manuel Miranda writing the music for a Disney movie.
As for the movie, perfect may be an understatement. Visually extraordinary. The animation of nature is beyond masterful; especially the Ocean - which, by itself, is a character in the movie. - All of the Characters are very well fleshed out, designed and animated brilliantly and topped off with some great voice acting. The integration of Hand drawn animation into a CG animated film really made me nerd out like a maniac. Not to mention Lin-Manuel Miranda's original songs are as genius as anything you would expect from the guy who wrote Hamilton. But all of this is just a cherry on top of the one thing that really makes this movie great: The story. Even if you strip all of that stuff away, you still have a powerful and beautiful narrative about having courage and being who you were made to be. I strongly recommend this movie, and 3D is definitely worth it.

If there is anything to criticise, I remember thinking a few times during the movie, "that was a good moment, but they could have gone farther with it and made it even better". But there wasn't anything in the movie that I wished wasn't in it.
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CanadianPixarFan
Pixar Post - T.J. wrote:
Wait - you think the only Oscar contention is between Zootopia and Moana? I agree that favoring an original rather than a sequel is good, but Dory should definitely be a contender not only because it was a great film, but because of the enormous box office success - fans have definitely responded with their wallets with this one!


I would say that Finding Dory is a contender for sure, and I predict it will get a nomination. That being said, there have been some major snubs in this category before so it's difficult to predict.

It's interesting to note a similarity between all three films that is very uncommon: The absence of a romantic sub-plot. I greatly appreciate all three films for not including one of these. I'm not against romantic subplots at all, I just don't think they are a necessary ingredient in every movie. Pixar has generally been good at keeping these out of the film unless they are necessary. But Moana on the other hand, is a Disney Princess movie with no love story. Let's just acknowledge how unheard of that is.

Out of the three contenders, my money is on Moana. I think they all deserve to win and perhaps, had they not all been released in the same year, they would have been frontrunners. But there can only be one winner and out of the three I just think Moana is the strongest film.
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Arlo
Ok so anyway here is my MOANA review-

Disney has recently had a long string of animated hits from Tangled to Ralph to Frozen to Big Hero to this years massive hit Zootopia. So how does this one compare?

Well let me first off start by saying I hate comparing films that I love. So I won't be comparing this film to Dory or Zootopia in any way, because i enjoyed all three films and loved them all and I don't want to put one down, because in the end I loved all three of them.

MOANA is a fantastic new Disney animated film directed by John Musker and Ron Clements, these are the guys responsible for The Little Mermaid and Aladdin. MOANA is a phonomenal film!!! I loved it so much!!!

First let's start off with the story. I thought the story was very creative and very different, but at the same time remained very repaectful of the Polynesian culture, which i also found fascinating! I love the story and all the things MOANA and Maui have to face on their journey. And the end of the film where MOANA confronts Te Ka, was probably hands down one of the most gorgeous endings I have seen in a very long time and the direction it takes is very mature and unexpected and provides a fantastic message about the power of forgiveness.

Now let's move on to the visuals. The visuals are fantastic! Every single detail is very nicely crafted. The character animation is great and whenever Maui transforms into something it is just so magical! The animation on Te Ka is beautiful and breathtakingly gorgeous. I also like some of the loonier designs for example the design of Hei Hei. Now the water in this film is magnificently beautiful, and it actually plays a character (think magic carpet from Aladdin) and the animation done on it is fantastic. Also Mini Maui (the traditionally animated part of the film animated by Eric Goldberg) is animated very well and reminds me of classic 90's Disney.

The characters in this film are great. MOANA is a fantastic lead and I love the fact that she is living up to so much more than the fact that she is a princess. She is a very strong, developed and compassionate character. She is the strongest female character of the year! She kicks serious butt! Expect a lot of little girls dressing up as MOANA next year for Halloween! Also Auli'i Cravahlo does a fantastic job as MOANA. Maui is also a very fun character, I love the egotistical aspect of his character and the fact that he made some mistakes that he is not proud of and through the film with MOANA learns to take responsibility for it. He is also very funny and so is Mini Maui, who is so funny and such a great side character! Dwayne Johnson was great as Maui and not to mention a killer singer! Hei Hei was also fantastic!! Alan Tudyk killed it!! Some of the films biggest laughs came from Maui, Mini Maui and Hei Hei. Now you're probably wondering about Pua. And Pua unfortaunetly didn't have as big of a part in this film as I hoped he would have, but overall he was a great character and some good laughs and awes came from! Tamatoa is a great character, and was pretty funny as were the Kakamoras! Te Ka was also great! Now it's time to talk about the most important relationship in the whole film other than MOANA and maui's and that is the one between MOANA and her grandmother Grandma Tala. Their relationship just works very well and I really enjoyed it, especially since we don't get too many animated films that focus on a relationship with a grandfather or grandmother. And some moments between the two had me tearing up. Grandma Tala is a great character.

Now the songs, so how can the songs not be good Hamilton creator and song-writer Lin Manuel Miranda is writing them along with Opetai Foia and Mark mancina (best known for his work on The Lion King). The songs in this film are great! So great in fact that you are going to want to keep listening to them over and over again so much that you are going to go out and actually buy a soundtrack. The songs in this film are so good. The stand-outs for me personally were "How Far I'll go", "You're Welcome" and "where you are". And trust me there are many other good songs in the film as well.

I thought MOANA was a fantastic film! And right after I came out of the theater I wanted to go back in and watch it again! It is that great! Disney has had a fantastic streak with their animated films this year with Zootopia and Finding Dory and MOANA doesn't break that streak. And once again proves that we are in another golden age for Disney Animation.

5/5 stars.
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Vellerie
I hate to say it, but I wasn't too crazy about Moana. I went in without keeping up with the sneak peeks or anything, and I wasn't quite sure what to expect, so I went in open minded.

There is a rightful clamoring for more representation of nonwhite people, nonAmerican/European cultures, and better portrayals of female characters, and while Moana did alright with this, the story itself fell flat for me. Aside from the setting and the grandma/granddaughter relationship, it was just formulaic and trope-filled, and Disney's lampshading/self-deprecating humor ("dress, animal companion, you're a princess," "You're not going to sing, are you?" and the twitter reference didn't help. If you're going to subvert the tropes, do so, but don't beat us over the head with the fact that you're being unoriginal, but with a twist.

Maui fulfilled much the same role as Nick/Flynn, belittling the heroine at every turn until she "earns" his respect, plus he gets that sob explanation for it like those two. The plot was straightforward and unsurprising. And the setting itself just seemed like such a surface - level view into the culture that inspired it. I understand it's a fantasy version of it, and maybe I need to watch it again, but it felt like everything was glossed over in a vague musical number montage.

Don't get me wrong, the movie was enjoyable enough, the animation gorgeous, and there were times when the protagonists were interesting and they had some unique little traits (Maui's tattoos for instance) but they never broke the mold for me. Moana reminded me of the heroines of Tangled/Frozen, and I already remarked on Maui's role. It's the same thing with different dressings but with a more lackluster plot. Idk if I'm unfairly comparing it to Disney's last works--I mean, I've always had similar criticisms for Frozen. I analyzed Zootopia as well, and while that one has that similar dynamic between the main characters that Tangled did and that "hating one another in the beginning trope," plus the male being rude to the heroine until she finally grows on him, but Zootopia had a more thrilling and well-paced plot, a nice social message, and I really felt the main characters were more than just cliches, they grew and developed and had a touching friendship that was tried at one point, when Judy accidentally hurt Nick's feelings. And they grew through that. I didn't feel any of that with Moana and Maui.

I feel strange feeling this way though, because most people, including critics, really love it.
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Bonnie
I think it's official; I've lost all my patience for the "wide eyed dreamer girl and snarky guy who looks down on her but only acts like that because of a tragic backstory" dynamic. I've seen four animated films released in 2016 so far and three of them used that dynamic (the remaining one was a sequel where the dark backstory'd already been revealed in a previous movie and the protagonist's a dude, so no option for it there). Between the three and earlier but still recent movies that also used it I'm so completely sick of it. I can't think of any other reason why this movie annoyed me as much as it did. Maybe it's not fair to judge a movie because of other films, but if "cliche" is a valid criticism then this should be.

Heihei annoyed me. Tattoo Maui annoyed me. Moana's grandma annoyed me. It didn't handle some songs well (Side character with no relevence to the plot at all? Better give them a song!). Moana's dad must be the reincarnation of Papa Henry because both of them blow up at their kids with no build up. 


And the thing's smug. It's smug in a way it didn't even earn (not that being smug is something that's EVER good). Your female born into a family that allows her to inherit and rule the land she lives on has a different title than the others (yes, I know in real life the differences between "chief's daughter" and "princess" are big, but within the context of the movies there isn't any)? You're going to acknowledge the cutesy sidekick cliche within a movie WITH TWO OF THE DARNED THINGS? You're gonna point out that people sing in musicals? Wow, I'm...not impressed at all. 


And if you'd like to make the argument that chief's daughter is in fact a noteworthy change, 1. they still don't need to bring it up. If something's truly subversive people will pick up on it. Going out of their way to point it out just makes it look like they either think people are too stupid to pick up on things or they don't think it's actually subversive so they need to point it out to give the impression it is. 2. there have already been movies with female characters that wear dresses and associate with leaders but different titles from "princess". Pocahantas had a Native American chief's daughter, Anastasia's a duchess, you could even make an argument for Sinbad: Legend of the Seven Seas where she's an ambassador. It's really not a new thing.

Yes, it's very pretty. I will give it that, and that "How Far I'll Go" is catchy, but that's far from enough to make me like it.


(Yes, I know I'm more ranting than reviewing. I've been losing, retyping, and picking at a post like this since late January/early February when I actually saw it, I just want to get me irritation out there.)



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Vellerie
Bonnie wrote:
I think it's official; I've lost all my patience for the "wide eyed dreamer girl and snarky guy who looks down on her but only acts like that because of a tragic backstory" dynamic. I've seen four animated films released in 2016 so far and three of them used that dynamic (the remaining one was a sequel where the dark backstory'd already been revealed in a previous movie and the protagonist's a dude, so no option for it there). Between the three and earlier but still recent movies that also used it I'm so completely sick of it. I can't think of any other reason why this movie annoyed me as much as it did. Maybe it's not fair to judge a movie because of other films, but if "cliche" is a valid criticism then this should be.



Oh, definitely, at this point it's as dull and unimpressive as the twist villain trope Disney and Pixar like to pull. Probably more annoying, for me, because the "rude male sidekick looking down upon the optimistic and idealistic heroine" is one that's present in the main characters. At least with the twist villain, the main characters still have the potential to be unique (Toy Story 3 and Monsters inc had twist villains, but didn't have the rude guy/textbook "strong girl"/heroes hating each other thing), which is more important to me since most of the screen time will be spent on the protagonists. So when most of the screentime is cliche, and when the back story reveal is something we all see coming as soon as the jerkish guy sets foot on the screen, the movie suffers a lot more.

Every time Hei Hei and Pua appeared, I whispered "merchandising" to the friend I was watching it with. Moana's dad was an entirely unconvincing helicopter parent for me, and basically fulfilled a non villainous version of Frollo's and Mother Gothel's roles, a short cut to give the protagonist motivation. The "sheltered protagonist who wants to see the world thing" is apparently another favorite plot device, but at least Hunchback has a more interesting twist on it (also, Hunchback, as one past Disney example, had a woman of color non-princess protagonist who doesn't end up with the main character romantically but rather in a touching friendship far before the likes of Moana, and it handled practically everything better...including music. So Moana doesn't get a pass for its uninspired plot for including those things. And yeah, I know Hunchback is based on the book, but as someone who's read it, I know Disney made LOADS of changes that include basically everything I've mentioned here). The self-conscious and self-deprecating slant to Moana was also a shame. Instead of shame-facedly being formulaic, how about you make a serious effort at being original?
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Bonnie
Vellerie wrote:
Oh, definitely, at this point it's as dull and unimpressive as the twist villain trope Disney and Pixar like to pull. Probably more annoying, for me, because the "rude male sidekick looking down upon the optimistic and idealistic heroine" is one that's present in the main characters. At least with the twist villain, the main characters still have the potential to be unique (Toy Story 3 and Monsters inc had twist villains, but didn't have the rude guy/textbook "strong girl"/heroes hating each other thing), which is more important to me since most of the screen time will be spent on the protagonists. So when most of the screentime is cliche, and when the back story reveal is something we all see coming as soon as the jerkish guy sets foot on the screen, the movie suffers a lot more.



Agreed on everything.

And on the subject of villains...I guess they weren't really trying on this one? I'm cool with that, I'd just kind of prefer the no villain/bit part villain approach happen in movies with protagonists less bland. 

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Every time Hei Hei and Pua appeared, I whispered "merchandising" to the friend I was watching it with.



My favorite thing with Hei Hei was when the rock almost fell off the canoe and he caught it, because it felt so much like a shoehorned, half-hearted attempt to make it look like he was necessary. I don't actually know if that was the intention, of course, but the pointlessness stuck out to me. It reminds me of Pascal tripping Gothel when she was already going to die; cut out those five seconds in either scene and nothing changes. 


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Moana's dad was an entirely unconvincing helicopter parent for me, and basically fulfilled a non villainous version of Frollo's and Mother Gothel's roles, a short cut to give the protagonist motivation.



My problem with the guy (and Henry) is that it seemed like they wanted him to not act like the kind of cliche disapproving parent, but they still wanted to fulfill the role of the disapproving parent.

The guy's portrayed as nice and all around patient, and though he has a path he wants his kid to follow he just kind of gently nudges her and doesn't let it overtake their relationship. But then she tries to get in the boat again, and suddenly the guy blows up at her. 

I'm not saying previously very loving parents' patience can't erode over time...it's just that there was no time. And if what she did was huge and terrible enough to instant break the relationship then I definitely missed it. 

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The "sheltered protagonist who wants to see the world thing" is apparently another favorite plot device, but at least Hunchback has a more interesting twist on it (also, Hunchback, as one past Disney example, had a woman of color non-princess protagonist who doesn't end up with the main character romantically but rather in a touching friendship far before the likes of Moana, and it handled practically everything better...including music. So Moana doesn't get a pass for its uninspired plot for including those things.
And yeah, I know Hunchback is based on the book, but as someone who's read it, I know Disney made LOADS of changes that include basically everything I've mentioned here). 



I honestly can't imagine giving the movie a pass for those types of things. Representation and avoiding cliches are good, but at the end of the day the very act of doing those things aren't holding up an entire movie. 


Especially since, like you said, Moana isn't the first to have protagonists that remain friends. There's Finding Nemo, Bolt (with Bolt and Mittens, I'm pretty sure. It's been a while), Frozen, Zootopia, and there's probably more I can't think of right now. Why give a movie points for doing something that isn't new and that's been proven to be solid ground to tread on? 

And let's face it Maui is like 15 times Moana's age and kind of not her species, and apparently she's 14, so she's very much underage. I'm pretty sure even if people didn't complain that's plenty of reason to believe they wouldn't have gotten together anyway. And if we're still going to accept it as something that was likely to happen, then I'm including Wreck-It Ralph in the list of movies where the protagonists don't get together. 

(And I was JUST reading some behind the scenes thing for a movie where they talked about not getting the leads together and now I can't remember it. I don't think it was Disney. It's killing me right now.)



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The self-conscious and self-deprecating slant to Moana was also a shame. Instead of shame-facedly being formulaic, how about you make a serious effort at being original?


They're been doing it for a while, it's not even really a slant, it's practically part of the formula. Princess and the Frog, Wreck-It Ralph (With the Vanellope princess stuff), Zootopia, Frozen, Big Hero Six, and now Moana all felt the need to talk about how subversive they're being, sometimes at the expense of the overall writing (way to spend so much time detailing to the audience how much you're against the love at first sight trope that your supposedly deeper sister relationship feels completely non-existent, Frozen!). Moana's just the one that's decided to throw out all logic attached to it.

I mean, is it obnoxious when Fred starts talking about how this guy is TOTALLY the villain, for real, he definitely is, this is the way things go, we totally have not made it super obvious it's the other guy? Yes. Does it at least make sense? Also yes, he's read comic books. It makes sense that someone kind of tomboyish wouldn't want to associate with something considered girly. It makes sense for someone taught that hard work is the most important thing to decry superstitions meant to give you instant good fortune.

It does not make sense for someone who, as far as we know, has never met princesses, to start whining about them, it does not make sense for him to reference dresses as an exclusive thing when everyone wears them (them or skirts), it doesn't make sense for the guy who already had his own musical number to whine about singing. 


(And special mention to Toy Story of Terror and Pricklepants, an early, non-Disney pioneer in the field of annoying meta comments.)

I imagine being original is a lot harder than just complaining about the cliches you're following.
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Arlo
Bonnie, I respect your opinion but I do think that you underestimate the amount of time and creativity it takes to put together an animated feature film. Moana, although parts may be something we have seen, takes those things and sort of makes them anew. Now you're welcome to your opinion, but at a certain point I think you are just criticizing a bit too much. As for Disney tropes, this is nothing new, Disney films have always had tropes, these new films are just taking these tropes and making something new and creative out of it. I get that this is your opinion, but a lot of time and effort was obviously put into it and I feel like you are hating on it too much for what it is.
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Bonnie
Arlo wrote:
Bonnie, I respect your opinion but I do think that you underestimate the amount of time and creativity it takes to put together an animated feature film.



I have no clue how we got from "Moana is a bland film with multiple problems in it" to "I don't understand the effort that goes into CGI". I know how hard it is to make these movies, I've even acknowledged before on this forum (in the thread I made about the books devoted to exploring the effort that went into specific films) that even sucky animated films have tons of effort put into them. It's something I endlessly admire about the medium. 

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Moana, although parts may be something we have seen, takes those things and sort of makes them anew.


Didn't feel like it to me, it felt very much like a retread. 

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Now you're welcome to your opinion, but at a certain point I think you are just criticizing a bit too much.



That seems arbitrary. I see something I don't think was done well/that was a flaw/that is really cliche and I complain about it. It's not like I'm making things up.


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As for Disney tropes, this is nothing new, Disney films have always had tropes,


This is true. However, they also had a tendency to not complain about the tropes they were using while using them, which made them simply formulaic instead of smug, hypocritical, AND formulaic. 

And I'm 20. I wasn't around for most of Disney's big movies. If I'd been around and old enough to complain about how formulaic they were I probably would have. 

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these new films are just taking these tropes and making something new and creative out of it.


It'd probably be a lot easier to make something new and creative without using the same character dynamics and types for four out of six films. Slight tweaks are not the same as entirely different characters. 

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I get that this is your opinion, but a lot of time and effort was obviously put into it and I feel like you are hating on it too much for what it is.


Every animated movie has effort. I'm willing to acknowledge where effort was put in on a movie (I already said it's pretty), but I don't consider it an excuse to get no criticism (or less). 

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